This coming Sunday, April 18th, will mark the opening of the two day WordAlone Ministries annual convention (when did they change from “network” to “ministries”?). The convention will take place at Calvary Lutheran of Golden Valley, Minnesota, a church that aspires to the mega-church model. I attended Sunday worship there a year ago to hear author William Young speak about his experiences behind his best-seller, The Shack, and the array of musicians and singers using the best technologies of sight and sound was impressive. Apart from the opening and closing, there really wasn’t much of a service other than the interesting, if a bit rambling, presentation by the novelist (the umpteenth service that morning?)
The Wordalone website offers a video presentation promoting the annual convention and a pdf brochure. The brochure takes a few paragraphs to get to what it claims to be the main thing, the proclamation of Christ, but the first paragraph betrays their real main theme:
In August 2009 ELCA Churchwide Assembly votes crossed yet another line in calling into question orthodox understandings of God’s Word. These very troubling decisions have caused a great storm of confusion, misinformation and conflict for Lutherans. Literally thousands of Lutherans are trying to discern what their next steps will be in the church. If you find yourself struggling with these issues, this convention has been designed with you in mind.
In addition to links to a lot of old speeches and position papers which have previously been covered here, the WordAlone website also cites their new blog, Faithful Transition. Even the blog was a little stale with the latest entry nearly two weeks old promoting their book, We Still Believe (with the implication that the rest of us do not).
Not much new over at the LCMC website either. The website claims 170 new LCMC congregations since CWA09 through the end of March (remember, the ELCA consists of over 10,000 congregations). As I have noted previously, the “Friends of LCMC” Google group has been made private so I can’t report on the conversation that is going on there. I suspect my earlier reporting had something to do with the change from public to private.
The latest addition to the Lutheran CORE website is a lengthy position paper written by Dr. Gerald B. Kieschnick, President, The Lutheran Church—Missouri Synod. Seems CORE is only too happy to provide a forum for LCMS rants against the ELCA. While the news media and the blogosphere is filled with discussions about the rampant homophobia of Uganda and other African nations (kill the gays bill), the Lutheran CORE blog’s latest entry is entitled, African Lutherans are ‘extremely disturbed’ by ELCA, Swedish actions on homosexual behavior.
It appears that Lutheran CORE would have the ELCA follow LCMS orthodoxy and African attitudes regarding homosexuality. Hmmm.
For being a bunch of liberal apostates (insert image of me rolling my eyes) we sure seem to be magnets for blogger that keep telling use we’re doing it wrong. The latest was “Exposing the ELCA” asking me what I thought about the ELCAs supersessionism when it comes to the Mideast Peace process. *waves to Dan*
He can’t be serious, can he?
One of the problems with CORE, LCMC and WA is the dogpiling of anything and everything they don’t like about the ELCA in the form of, to quote one of those LOLCats: UR doing it Wrong!
You know what? When I don’t like something, I tend to walk away from it. The ELCA is hardly a perfect organization. It has its flaws like every other. But repeatedly telling me that I’m doing it wrong? Quickest way for me stop a conversation because it has degraded into nothing meaningful.
It appears that Lutheran CORE would have the ELCA follow LCMS orthodoxy and African attitudes regarding homosexuality. Hmmm.
I find it interesting that the religousaholics always want to hold up Africa as an example of homophobic religious orthodoxy. On a recent mission trip to Africa I was talking to a pastor who was lecturing me on homosexual behavior. I countered with a question as to his churches “turning a blind eye” to polygamy in the rural villages (I met two pastors with multiple wives). “The church doesn’t indorse it” he said, however they will perform weddings, which in my view is a form of condoning. I would hope we could find a better example of Christian living then Africa.
Oh come on Obie, you are a better writer than this.
The evil Uganda bill is on par with the ELCT sermon? Gag. This is as bad a piece of reporting as what you were complaining about with the RCC equating homosexuality with child molesting.
You are better than this … and if you are not, I will cease to be your unofficial voice of whatever … because I will quit coming here. 🙂
@Tony Stoutenburg
While the oppressive Ugandan “kill the gays” bill is an extreme example, which many African religious spokesmen would disavow, the point remains that the African views of human sexuality are rather unenlightened and should hardly be proposed as examples for the ELCA to follow.
Although I seldom agree with your comments, they are welcome here, but I find your threat to leave unless I somehow rise to your standards to reflect a certain consistency with the LCMC/WordAlone/CORE mindset.
Kelly says that if she doesn’t like something she tends to walk away. You say that threatening to do that sounds like an attitude you disdain. But you like Kelly. I’m soooo confused…
LCMC has NOT threatened to leave. Most of us have just left. And those who have not are threatened with sanction.
My objection was strenous due to a grossly unfair linkage that you have now walked back. Thank you.
I thought that a respectful appreciation of other cultures was a Liberal virtue. But you write “African views … are rather unenlightened” !?!? Oh my. Do I need a pith helmet to quote that? What accent? I’m soooooo confused!
ts
I was just about ready to walk back into our LCMC church the other day when I decided to check out a member’s site “social concerns at Jimdo”. When I saw all the garbage he had collected for his site and knowing that he is still on the church council– I said No Way.
I really think that Tony and Obie need to meet at a bar some place half way between Northfield and Hayward and arm wrestle over this whole issue. That will make about as much sense as arguing about it. It is over in Clintonville and one lady didn’t make her potato salad for the salad luncheon. They were down about 25 people for the dinner. Now those are the important things anyway because the money helps pay for Bible Camp.
Theology is theology- arguing about what the unseen God looks like and what he/she thinks. Except for the 2000-5000 year old book we don”t know.
Being respectful of another culture and holding another’s cultural views up for us to follow are two different things. When I was Africa I didn’t lecture my friend on the misguided idea of polygamy,or his churches unwillingness to stop it,(a custom he feels is supported by scripture) Because it is their culture and not mine, I would not hold it up as the norm for our church in American. I think what Obie is implying is that why should we be worried as to what the Africans think of our ordination or gays? Are they the standard that we wish to emulate in the US? I don’t think so.
Tony,
To clarify, if there is something I don’t agree with, I don’t start a campaign of throwing things against a wall and hope that something sticks in order to make it look bad. I have a problem with websites like Dan Skogen’s “Exposing the Lutheran Church” because, Dan, if you hate it that much, why don’t you just leave and not worry about it any more. I don’t go trolling/posting on LCMC forums, etc because I figure that is a safe place for Tony and other advocates to meet and discuss their needs.
Do I blog? Heck yes. I have lots of opinions and let me show you them. But it usually relates (unless I’m ranting about football)to how it impacts me personally. I like to think my blog reflect that. But you will never see an an “Exposing the LCMC or Core or WA or Minnesota Vikings (sorry, Obie, I bleed green and gold. Always have, always will.)because I just don’t work that way.
I think what Obie was alluding to was the dramatic internet phenomenon known as the Flounce (encyclopediadramatica.com/Flounce) otherwise known as the Farwell Cruel Interwebs maneuver with the announcment of leaving instead of, well, just leaving.
I probably just innundated everyone with too many pop culture references, so I’ll just stop while I’m ahead.
@Kelly
Bleeding green and gold….is that painful?
Bleeding green and gold isn’t painful or my husband would have been dead long ago. Now the Vikings people only have one part of their religion to worry about- will he or won’t he-Brett finally retire.
Have fun Kelly. This is a good place to vent. It has helped me make some sense of it all.
Returning just for the moment back to one issue raised in the blog conversation, I am unhappy with defining other cultures as “enlightened” as we describe how homosexuality is viewed in other places around the world. Sexuality is far too complex to dismiss thousands of cultures and centuries with one term. Furthermore, in this “flat” world, to assume that countries and people do not know about the fact that homosexuality is viewed in various ways in North America and Europe would be naïve. And to assume that this culture war is not reverberating (thus “exported”) in other countries — and churches — is also naïve.
By the same token to not be critical of how other countries and cultures persecute the LGBT communities and peoples would be wrong as well. And to not be aware of how some, particularly a few evangelical Christians Americans, are using their resources to exploit the issues to their advantage would be disastrous.
That being said, underlying the discussion and what I find so mystifying is the American class war and cultural bias and assumptions that are included as well and forced onto other countries; the “chardonnay drinking know it all Liberals” versus the “beer drinking average Joe.” As if there is a difference, both are alcohol based (no irony there) — when is prohibition when you need it!
In what I read, you can put whichever Lutheran bodies into whichever “class” you deem appropriate. Yet, I think that is exactly what is not being discussed in this most recent splintering among some Lutherans. I sense this flareup around the issue of pastors living out a committed loving relationship with a person of the same sex as it relates to thoughtful Biblical interpretation, tradition and orthodoxy than it does underlying fear, pain, anger, confusion and denial that is being lived out — systems theory — in local Lutheran churches in the US.
oops… last paragraph should be a complete sentence rather than a weird run on. Rephrase: I sense this flareup around the issue of pastors living out a committed loving relationship with a person of the same sex has less to do with thoughtful Biblical interpretation, tradition and orthodoxy than it does with with underlying fear, pain, anger, confusion and denial that is being lived out —systems theory— in local Lutheran churches in the US.
So…Give that ELCT bishop a break — even a virtual attabrother-in-Christ. How many times have we been admonished by our ELCA leaders to (1)receive the gift of being re-evangelized by those to whom we sent missionaries in centuries, generations and decades past — not to mention (2)continue supporting our ELCA companion synods with our prayers, presence and presents? How well have we received that admonishment? Seems to us that the ELCT Bishop was saying yes to item (1) and recognizing the co-opting that can be perceived, threatened and even accomplished in connection with item (2). And, given that his statement echoed the pre-LWF assembly document issued through the LWF Africa section, we’d conclude that the ELCT Bishop was not speaking only for himself. Who’d like to be a mouse in the corner when ELCT-PB meets ELCA-PB for this discussion?
@tony stoutenburg
Well, Tony, I guess I do have a church in the area that is staying with ELCA. It is St. John’s in Marion. I read their website yesterday and saw that they had taken a vote so I called and found out the results. I have to check them out in person yet.