For those who don’t know, Rachel Maddow is the host of her own show on MSNBC on weeknights. She is the freshest voice on network news. According to her description from her website,
Rachel has a doctorate in political science (she was a Rhodes Scholar) and a background in HIV/AIDS activism and prison reform. She shakes a mean cocktail, drives a bright red pickup, hates Coldplay, loves arguing with conservatives, spends a lot of money on AMTRAK tickets, and dresses like a first-grader.
She could also have been a lawyer. As a former trial lawyer myself, I envy her skills at cross examination evidenced in the following interview (aka smackdown) of a reparative therapy advocate and pseudo-psychologist named Richard Cohen. I was kidding about that crush part since she’s gay–I’m straight–and we’re both in happy relationships.
Enjoy.
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I really enjoyed this link, Obie.
I would like to pull a couple of things from the interview and point them out here:
Richard Cohen cites anecdotal evidence, ie his own marriage, as scientific proof that gayness can be cured. I’m sorry, but a case study of 1 is hardly scientific proof. It only proves that he is either bisexual or lying to himself and others.
He cites his own bonding issues with his father for his sexual orientation. Um, no. It only means he has had issues with his father. Nothing more, nothing less.
These reasons for “making one gay” are nlaughable and nothing short than insulting and not rooted in any fact:
Thanks for bringing this over, Obie.
I recently had a conversation with a pastor of a local Lutheran church from a more conservative persuasion. He told me of a place where men and women who are gay can go and be cured. He thought I should refer people to this place as part of the addiction program we have here at Lost and Found Ministry. I visited this “treatment facilities” web site and it was very interesting. Several testimonials of how people “got straight through Jesus.” As I dug deeper into these story I leaned that when people graduate from the program they are allow occasional same sex encounters. Very strange, that would be like telling an alcoholic a drunk every now and then is ok.
Well now, ain’t that interesting. It has been my observation that lots of people with problems get “born again” and are over their problems for a while. A couple I knew when I was teaching became very strict Baptists. But what about their poor kids who were learning disabled from Fetal Alcohol syndrome. I never guessed that a good friend of my son was gay but then I didn’t know everything back then. The friend’s first crush was on a member of the boy’s swim team. He tried marriage to a WELS member girl but it didn’t work. He is very happily partnered now. Another man I know of was “saved ” by a Baptist group when he was in jail. He went straight for awhile but is now back in jail because he stole something again.
I sound kind of cynical about the “Born Again” cures. Coupled with continued therapy or AA this might work for some things. With gays I doubt it would be able to do anything but make them celebate for a while.
Being “Born Again” can be a strong incentive to try to change whatever “sin” is the trouble but after while that strong incentive wears off or the person finds that all the other people in the church or group are human after all. Or new temptations enter in and the Born Again person just takes up a new version of old behavior. My best wishes to anyone who thinks they can get Jesus Christ to change someone permanently. Maybe it works sometimes.
I have found the “born again” language to be a stumbling block to people in addiction and in Recovery who are working on their spirituality. “All you need is to know Jesus and you will be cured” just isn’t workable. If this were true Christians would never get cancer or have a car accident. One Sunday I asked the question at Recovery “just what does being born again mean to you?” The response was interesting, most responded along the line of “every time someone asks me if I am born again I turn them off.” It isn’t the Theological idea of being born again that bothers them, it is the fundamental overtone that the question has that turns them off, and so we use different language like “we are a new creation.”
Thanks Ray. The fundamentalist overtone is what bothers me too. It isn’t just that Jesus Christ can set you free but the you gotta do this, and this, and this, and this or you are not truly a Christian.
I have a crush on Rachel Madow, too, Obie! I was first introduced to her shortly after Obama received his Nobel nomination; she did a marvelous and eloquent piece that responded to all the vitriol that started spewing shortly after the news broke.